Tuesday, July 8, 2014
Chutzpah
The Egyptian Military Dictatorship, fresh from demanding the US Government stop the legal trade in undocumented Egyptian artifacts, has now demanded that the Borough of Northampton stop the sale of an Egyptian artifact long in its possession. Will British local government stand up to these imperialists against such meddling? Surely so. Will our US State Department also show some spine and stand up for US small businesses, collectors and Museums? Sadly, probably not given indications that the MOU with Egypt has already been pre-judged after some behind the scenes lobbying by politically connected archaeological organizations with a vested interest in the corrupt status quo in that troubled country.
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“According to UNESCO’s 1970 Convention on the Means of Prohibiting and Preventing illicit Import, Export and Transfer of Ownership of Cultural Property," said a council spokeswoman, "Egypt has no right to claim the recovery of the statue, as the statue left Egypt before this convention was put in place and this was confirmed by the Egyptian Government on June 15.”
I'm sure ALL supporters of the UNESCO Convention on such matters, especially a Mr Barford of Warsaw, will clammer to prevent this important UNESCO ruling from being undermined or overturned by the humbug shown by the generals.
Usual best regards
John Howland
England
Mr Tompa, I having again skewered Mr P Barford of Warsaw, this time over his apparent selective failure to support his occasional employers, UNESCO, and their 1970 Convention on Export and Ownership, preferring unsurprisingly, by way of reply, to defend his hopeless position by pointing out my misspelling of the word clamour.
While he heaps invective, insults, innuendo, on collectors in a continual stream of monotonous, holier-than-thou whining about what he perceives is a lack of ethics in collecting circles, he appears conveniently to have mislaid his own.
Either Mr Barford's ethics lie with UNESCO's 1970 Convention, or they don't. If I've missed the hidden paragraph in the 1970 UNESCO Convention known only to Mr P Barford himself that reads:- “Egypt’s military regimes excluded,” I shall stand corrected.
Let he who is without spelling sin cast the first stone…on 4th July, Mr P Barford wrote, ”…the logical fallacies that emerged fro discussions with the…” I would have used the word ‘from’.
Best regards
John Howland
England
Mr Tompa, I having again skewered Mr P Barford of Warsaw, this time over his apparent selective failure to support his occasional employers, UNESCO, and their 1970 Convention on Export and Ownership, preferring unsurprisingly, by way of reply, to defend his hopeless position by pointing out my misspelling of the word clamour.
While he heaps invective, insults, innuendo, on collectors in a continual stream of monotonous, holier-than-thou whining about what he perceives is a lack of ethics in collecting circles, he appears conveniently to have mislaid his own.
Either Mr Barford's ethics lie with UNESCO's 1970 Convention, or they don't. If I've missed the hidden paragraph in the 1970 UNESCO Convention known only to Mr P Barford himself that reads:- “Egypt’s military regimes excluded,” I shall stand corrected.
Let he who is without spelling sin cast the first stone…on 4th July, Mr P Barford wrote, ”…the logical fallacies that emerged fro discussions with the…” I would have used the word ‘from’.
Best regards
John Howland
England
mr howland obviously didnt read the article.the egyption government was questioning the ethics of the sale they are not trying to repatriate the piece.in fact the minister is quoted as saying that museums should "spread culture and not try to simply earn money".personally i think northampton council are acting disgracefully by selling this piece.it was donated with specific instructions that it was not to be sold but put on display for the benefit of the citizens of northampton.anyone thinking of donating anything to any museum now will think twice about doing so.
another thing peter,your continued references to the military dictatorship in egypt ect ect,you seem to forget that they are in power with the full backing of the US and the UK governments,who are supplying them with arms and money archaeologist have nothing to do with them and have no influence over them whatsoever.
kyri.
I'm not sure why the Egyptian government should be sticking its nose into this, particularly when its a military dictatorship that appears reprehensible to most everyone but archaeologists and foreign policy types. I'm not sure how much their power depends on US or UK support. Unfortunately, though the archaeological establishment has a long history of cozy relationships with Middle Eastern dictators in places like Egypt and even far worse ones in Syria and Iraq.
Mr Tompa, kyri can't be allowed to lapse unchallenged into 'Barfordism'.
Archaeologists have a duty to distance themselves from that wretched military regime in Egypt, a regime that has just passed the death penalty on over 180 political opponents.
If as kyri critically suggests, that the US and UK governments are supplying the generals with arms and money, then archaeologists having any truck with this monstrous regime, or who support any facet of it - antiquities salvation or not - have blood on their hands.
The UK and US governments also supported by trading with the Nazi government up to 1939, and the Communist Bloc until 1989. Perhaps kyri is unaware of the track-record of these two vile regimes both not widely known for their humanity. Yet, some archaeologists found them attractive enough, to work alongside, or, for them.
The current craze amongst those heritologists with a bankrupt argument is alleging that collectors are financing Middle East terrorists by buying looted items from them.
Significantly, condemnation of the terrorist groups by archaeologists for looting the artifacts in the first place, is rarer than hen's teeth.
Best wishes
John Howland
England
peter/john im just pointing out some facts.the egyption government did not ask for the statue back and were happy for it to remain in the museum on display.as for who has blood on their hands, the us government just last month released $575 million in MILITARY aid to sisi.if anyone has blood on their hands it certainly is not the archaeologists,whos only concern is the safegaurding of the cultural history of egypt.they have no influence over who governs egypt and just have to work with whoever is in charge however distasteful they may be,our governments have the power to make a change but at the moment they would support anyone and anything that keeps the muslim brotherhood at bay and i for one dont blame them.may i also add that i collect ww1-ww2 memorabilia and have studied both wars thoroughly and i certainly dont need a history lesson from mr howland.the only thing i would agree with him on is the "collectors are funding terrorists" rhetoric,with the oil revenues pouring in for isis i think antiquities looting for resale is the last thing on their minds,just today i read an article on the bbc news by diana darke about isis selling a few pieces but "destroying many more antiquities that represent humans or gods" any dealer would tell you that the statues ect is where the money is .i personally believe most of the looting is by the local people for their own personal financial gain and not for idealogical reasons.i must also add that as a hard nosed capitalist anyone saying that unethical dealing and collecting is not driving the looting does not understand the simple rule in economics of supply and demand.before im accused by john of being a hypocrite,ill put my hands up and admit that im no angel in all this and though i praise david knell for sticking to a pre 1970s provenance for his collecting i must admit im not so pious but i certainly dont buy anything without at least 25-30 years of collecting history.im sure i must have many looted pieces in my collection but at least i know my pieces didnt come out of the ground yesterday.i also keep records/reciepts for everything i buy,something we should all do,dealers and collectors.
kyri.
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